I love your summary of "please don't throw poison..." But to answer your question, I do damage to my own earth home, insult my own (especially other-than-human) friends, and even feel out of place with myself. You?
Yes indeed Andrei. To reiterate: anyone may comment, no matter how 'fragmentary' they may be. We are all fragmentary. But I have a zero tolerance policy on aggression, rudeness, trolling and the kind of nastiness that is so common elsewhere on the web. I want this to be an inviting place in which all feel able to express themselves. It's not what you say, but how you say it.
Here's my (slightly edited) post: Paul, I'm joining you on this journey. But one of your closing phrases leaves a raunchy taste: "I will deny commenting rights to anyone who attempts to bring those fragmentary oppositions into this space. We’re going to try and practice kindness and mercy here. It’s an Abbey after all." I think a more beautiful question is, How can we be unified with us, including us who practice fragmentary thinking? Who can judge fragmentary thinking from unifying thinking? I understand the intent to make a place of kindness - but is the way, by excluding those less careful with their own souls and those of others? - What I'm questioning Paul about is the threat to "deny commenting rights to anyone who..." and the reason is that, far from excluding, Jesus invited the most fragmentary-thinking people to himself, essentially saying "you're part of us, too." That's a bold example to me, and one I feel offense against in Paul's position. I'm not arguing for nastiness, but who's to say if Jesus is one of the nasty-speaking ones - his contemporaries thought so...
Hi, Jonas, I deactivated my NAAS account as I was finding it mostly irrelevant to me and getting repetitive and would rather place energy elsewhere. I have been doing a weekly Zoom with some other NAAS and those involved have liked it. It’s unstructured and a broad range of topics have been discussed intellectual, personal and healing personal sharing. It’s small never more than 5 or so. If you would like to drop in sometime - dropping in only for a short time, one timers and only occasional types are quite welcome - private message Johnny Misheff your email and I can put you on the weekly Zoom reminder email. Hope to Zee you sometime Jeff Alexander
Thank you Paul for giving this a go. Your efforts, your words are more helpful than you may realize. It is no accident that you are unable to turn away “quietly.” You seem to be a warrior at heart and such a God given spirit will not and cannot rest completely until it’s appointed time. I think of the gifted American Civil War general Stonewall Jackson, who’s last reported words, upon being mortally wounded, were “Let us go over, and sit in the shade of the trees.“ This his spirit was able to say only when his part in a horrific “maelstrom” was finished. One FAR bigger than he, his motives, his desires or any singular ability to “change the world.” I hope you can accept such a comparison as such men, because of the “side” on which they fought, are now totally cancelled and their complexities as human beings within a specific time and place largely ignored and deemed unworthy of any hearing. I myself am only recently learning how to “break bread with the dead” and give a more careful and kind and merciful, as you say, listen before “speaking.” I’m often finding it a humbling education. You also help me to listen to some things to which I have been deaf.
At any rate, Godspeed to you in this endeavor and as an Orthodox inquirer myself, I will keep you and your family in my prayers.
Let it be so. Grateful for your writing, thoughts, and imagination. They have been such an aid to me as I walk through this strange age, and I’m certain they will continue to be for many until we reach that age without end.
Many thanks for this rich piece. Much to ponder on. I look forward to more. I discovered your writings only recently through Rod Dreher's blogs. I saw a video of a recent interview you gave on which you touched on 'Techno-gnosticism' and the destruction of so much of England and was reminded of C.S. Lewis's 'That hideous strength' the third novel of his science-fiction trilogy first published in 1945.. It treats fictionally many of the themes in his prophetic 'The Abolition of Man'. I must have first read the novel 30 years ago and thought it a bit OTT then but now it just seems so prescient, even to the evil genius whose brain is kept alive after his guillotining. If you don't know it already I'd recommend it.
Interesting that you mention the Situationists. Over Lent I became convinced that a form of Christian Situationism was kind-of vital right now. Exactly how one would go about forming a collective to do it is an open question. If anyone reading this fancies it, buzz me?
Brain dump: The profane and postmodern has become so mainstream that asserting anything else has become radical. I reckon a sort of slightly anarchic multi-media thing disrupting materialist and consumerist streams of thought in places that they're most manifest. It would have to generate outrage and confuse people by challenging their ideas about themselves, and subvert the symbols they use to make a new point, similar to what the likes of the Church of the Subgenius did, but in reverse. Also asserting the reality of miracles and the existence of higher reality (and the World Behind the World) in a profoundly offbeat way... Potentially misquoting prominent atheists and materialists as a form of satire?
This just occurred to me: In the Chilango burrito chain restaurant in Manchester, they've installed a shrine to the Theotokos as a piece of kitch furniture - it would be lovely to watch 20 people descend on the place and hold a constant vigil there. An example perhaps?
Or like the flash mob that sang the Hallelujah Chorus in a food court back in 2010. Christ is suddenly risen among French fries and burgers. See it here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SXh7JR9oKVE
Am a long running fan of your work, Paul, and just became a subscriber- thanks so much for starting this series of essays. I'm also a longtime fan of independent journalism and magazines, and as an American from Tennessee, want to keep the tradition of periodicals and freedom of the press that my country was a forerunner of, even if in an online format.
One question: since the whole idea of this subscription system is to make sure you have some income, what are the guidelines on sharing pieces or an entirety of one of your essays? I would certainly understand if it needs to be totally under wraps for non-subscribers.
Thanks Geoffery, I appreciate it. I agree about the periodicals. I have always loved little pamphlets myself. Maybe that will come.
As for this question: I suppose it's up to me, and in this case my answer would be that I don't mind (and can't stop) subscribers from occasionally sending my essays to friends if they like them. I would ask two things though: firstly, that this is only occasional (ie, that people are not seeing all my essays if they're not subscribers) and secondly that you point them to where they can sign up if they want to.
Having said that, I'd also say that if you have low-income friends who would benefit from reading anything I write, then of course I am not going to complain if you send them over (not that I would probably find out anyway ...)
ah, sounds good. That's kind of what I was thinking. I'll be very conservative about sharing any of your stuff, and also be open about encouraging people to subscribe if they want to read your stuff in full. I like getting back to the subscription model! It's more honest and sustainable as an income stream.
I think that the author meant "please don't throw poison and division via aggressive commentaries".
That's what I understood. Not being critical and against what's written. We can debate without being in an ideological war, without hatred.
Would you invite to your place someone who would damage your home? Or who would insult your friends?
I love your summary of "please don't throw poison..." But to answer your question, I do damage to my own earth home, insult my own (especially other-than-human) friends, and even feel out of place with myself. You?
(it's a bit weird to continue the thread as the original message was deleted)
I do my best not hurting other people's feelings. Sometimes I fail.
I will stop my participation in this thread here.
Yes indeed Andrei. To reiterate: anyone may comment, no matter how 'fragmentary' they may be. We are all fragmentary. But I have a zero tolerance policy on aggression, rudeness, trolling and the kind of nastiness that is so common elsewhere on the web. I want this to be an inviting place in which all feel able to express themselves. It's not what you say, but how you say it.
Here's my (slightly edited) post: Paul, I'm joining you on this journey. But one of your closing phrases leaves a raunchy taste: "I will deny commenting rights to anyone who attempts to bring those fragmentary oppositions into this space. We’re going to try and practice kindness and mercy here. It’s an Abbey after all." I think a more beautiful question is, How can we be unified with us, including us who practice fragmentary thinking? Who can judge fragmentary thinking from unifying thinking? I understand the intent to make a place of kindness - but is the way, by excluding those less careful with their own souls and those of others? - What I'm questioning Paul about is the threat to "deny commenting rights to anyone who..." and the reason is that, far from excluding, Jesus invited the most fragmentary-thinking people to himself, essentially saying "you're part of us, too." That's a bold example to me, and one I feel offense against in Paul's position. I'm not arguing for nastiness, but who's to say if Jesus is one of the nasty-speaking ones - his contemporaries thought so...
Hi, Jonas, I deactivated my NAAS account as I was finding it mostly irrelevant to me and getting repetitive and would rather place energy elsewhere. I have been doing a weekly Zoom with some other NAAS and those involved have liked it. It’s unstructured and a broad range of topics have been discussed intellectual, personal and healing personal sharing. It’s small never more than 5 or so. If you would like to drop in sometime - dropping in only for a short time, one timers and only occasional types are quite welcome - private message Johnny Misheff your email and I can put you on the weekly Zoom reminder email. Hope to Zee you sometime Jeff Alexander
So pleased to have discovered you and your Abbey.
Great start, looking forward to the journey.
I’m glad you haven’t burned the pens. Maybe one day you can beat them into pruning hooks.
Darn. Things like this are what keep me in the matrix! Oh, well...
Thank you Paul for giving this a go. Your efforts, your words are more helpful than you may realize. It is no accident that you are unable to turn away “quietly.” You seem to be a warrior at heart and such a God given spirit will not and cannot rest completely until it’s appointed time. I think of the gifted American Civil War general Stonewall Jackson, who’s last reported words, upon being mortally wounded, were “Let us go over, and sit in the shade of the trees.“ This his spirit was able to say only when his part in a horrific “maelstrom” was finished. One FAR bigger than he, his motives, his desires or any singular ability to “change the world.” I hope you can accept such a comparison as such men, because of the “side” on which they fought, are now totally cancelled and their complexities as human beings within a specific time and place largely ignored and deemed unworthy of any hearing. I myself am only recently learning how to “break bread with the dead” and give a more careful and kind and merciful, as you say, listen before “speaking.” I’m often finding it a humbling education. You also help me to listen to some things to which I have been deaf.
At any rate, Godspeed to you in this endeavor and as an Orthodox inquirer myself, I will keep you and your family in my prayers.
I'm very excited by your project. Thank you, Mr. Kingsnorth.
Your writing is a gift. I am so glad you are writing again and that you have found Christ.
Your words in this piece express what I haven’t been able to articulate well so thank you for this.
Let it be so. Grateful for your writing, thoughts, and imagination. They have been such an aid to me as I walk through this strange age, and I’m certain they will continue to be for many until we reach that age without end.
Many thanks for this rich piece. Much to ponder on. I look forward to more. I discovered your writings only recently through Rod Dreher's blogs. I saw a video of a recent interview you gave on which you touched on 'Techno-gnosticism' and the destruction of so much of England and was reminded of C.S. Lewis's 'That hideous strength' the third novel of his science-fiction trilogy first published in 1945.. It treats fictionally many of the themes in his prophetic 'The Abolition of Man'. I must have first read the novel 30 years ago and thought it a bit OTT then but now it just seems so prescient, even to the evil genius whose brain is kept alive after his guillotining. If you don't know it already I'd recommend it.
I'd also like to welcome you as a Christian.
Thank you and welcome to the machine (ending!)
Interesting that you mention the Situationists. Over Lent I became convinced that a form of Christian Situationism was kind-of vital right now. Exactly how one would go about forming a collective to do it is an open question. If anyone reading this fancies it, buzz me?
Intriguing. What would that look like, do you think? I don't know a great deal about Situationism beyond their public writings.
Brain dump: The profane and postmodern has become so mainstream that asserting anything else has become radical. I reckon a sort of slightly anarchic multi-media thing disrupting materialist and consumerist streams of thought in places that they're most manifest. It would have to generate outrage and confuse people by challenging their ideas about themselves, and subvert the symbols they use to make a new point, similar to what the likes of the Church of the Subgenius did, but in reverse. Also asserting the reality of miracles and the existence of higher reality (and the World Behind the World) in a profoundly offbeat way... Potentially misquoting prominent atheists and materialists as a form of satire?
I recall reading about the Situationists in Greil Marcus’ Lipstick Traces. This is a fascinating idea, one I would love to explore in further details
This just occurred to me: In the Chilango burrito chain restaurant in Manchester, they've installed a shrine to the Theotokos as a piece of kitch furniture - it would be lovely to watch 20 people descend on the place and hold a constant vigil there. An example perhaps?
Wow. I suppose I shouldnt be surprised but I still am. I love that idea. Orthodox Situationist flashmobbing ...
Well, I should correct myself, it's more of a Catholic shrine a la Mexico, hence the cultural appropriation. Same principle stands!
Or like the flash mob that sang the Hallelujah Chorus in a food court back in 2010. Christ is suddenly risen among French fries and burgers. See it here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SXh7JR9oKVE
Then there's this one, still timely after Easter, in Arabic, then Greek, then Arabic again: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZvgWscw5Gbs
Am a long running fan of your work, Paul, and just became a subscriber- thanks so much for starting this series of essays. I'm also a longtime fan of independent journalism and magazines, and as an American from Tennessee, want to keep the tradition of periodicals and freedom of the press that my country was a forerunner of, even if in an online format.
One question: since the whole idea of this subscription system is to make sure you have some income, what are the guidelines on sharing pieces or an entirety of one of your essays? I would certainly understand if it needs to be totally under wraps for non-subscribers.
Thanks Geoffery, I appreciate it. I agree about the periodicals. I have always loved little pamphlets myself. Maybe that will come.
As for this question: I suppose it's up to me, and in this case my answer would be that I don't mind (and can't stop) subscribers from occasionally sending my essays to friends if they like them. I would ask two things though: firstly, that this is only occasional (ie, that people are not seeing all my essays if they're not subscribers) and secondly that you point them to where they can sign up if they want to.
Having said that, I'd also say that if you have low-income friends who would benefit from reading anything I write, then of course I am not going to complain if you send them over (not that I would probably find out anyway ...)
All the best,
Paul
ah, sounds good. That's kind of what I was thinking. I'll be very conservative about sharing any of your stuff, and also be open about encouraging people to subscribe if they want to read your stuff in full. I like getting back to the subscription model! It's more honest and sustainable as an income stream.
Thank you! Keep writing....
Looking forward to reading your essays Paul. :)